Ep 11 - Colonial Day

[Ioraptor]

I'm starting to get a feel for Adama as a George Washington/Cincinatus type;

"When we assumed the soldier, we did not lay down the citizen." -George Washington

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He's a curious mix of liberal humanitarian (indeed, humanocentric) and hard case patriot.

Anyhoo..... it was fun to see Ellen work her witchy (no offense to wiccans meant) magic...is she a Cylon? Is she a sociopath? Is she a b***h or what?

I love the ambiguity of events and characters. We might NEVER know if Tom Zarek had the would-be assassin killed. Or we might find out next episode.

It was interesting to get a glimpse into Toms political philosoply, he's a communist!

[Mil]

I loved the episode. I love conflicts where you have to be careful in taking sides because your side might not be right.

IMHO
Tom Zarek‘s character seams bad in part because the character we have been brought to sympathize with think he is bad. As the military types by nature dislike disorder it is natural for them to have dislike for a revolutionary. So far we have been allowed to see that the president and Adama are trying their best for the betterment of all but it is very real on the show that it is difficult for the citizens to know that because they don’t have the god like view we in the audience have. Also my observation of human nature is the boredom of the normal person in the fleet would lead to lots of passionate political dialog as they have not too many other destractions.

Zarek did show a glory seeking power hungry side during the prison revolt. I don’t completely look down on him for that because effective leaders for a cause on both sides of an issue can have the power hungry flaw but that does not automatically mean that there views and what they will do with power are wrong.

I do tend to distrust Zarek’s politics because often in history when people from the hard right or left get in power they often fall into taking actions to redress past wrongs that actually cause equal or greater wrongs. Plus the zeal tends to remove rational thought so that when common sense diverges from the ideals of the radical the radical tends to stay with their ideal even if it fails baddy.

Still that does not mean Zarek would be a bad president. He could be more pragmatic than he appears and once he views what Adama and the old president have been doing from the inside he might cool down and run things intelegently.

It would be smart for Adama and Laura to try to open a dialog to find out if Zarek can be tempered by seeing the truth of their actions. Plus Adama and the president could find out if Zarek really is the hard head they think he is or not.

[Roadrunner]

I enjoyed this episode, but I don't rank it as one of the best of the series. Lots of continuity issues here.

Announcing Grey as Laura's right-hand man, responsible for keeping the fleet going and this-that-and-the-other when we've never even seen him before was more than slightly jarring.

The fleet doesn't even have enough pilots (especially after the losses in last week's ep) to maintain a decent CAP, but the two top guns can be handed off to lead a security detail for a political pow-wow? Well... it's far-fectched, but it did give us a chance to see Lee and Kara engaged in a water fight and brawling it up in the bar, so I'll let it slide.

What happened to Grimes? After Apollo crashed the bottle over his head, he disappeared. If he was supposedly associated with Valence (and Zarek) shouldn't there have been more mention of him and what role he might be playing in the conspiracy?

I was amused to see the "bad cop" role played (with much enthusiasm) by Apollo, while Starbuck played the calmer member of the duo. You would typically expect to see Starbuck playing hardball while Apollo was the "nice guy." Nice little change up there.

I thought it was a nice touch to deliberately avoid showing the audience whether Baltar won the election by vote from the council, or if the President had to break the tie. Each scenario paints a very different picture of the current political power base. Stay tuned.

What was the story with Apollo's disappearing act at the end? I guess we have to assume that Baltar asked to cut in on the dance floor, but after Starbuck's disdain for Baltar earlier in the episode, her apparent willingness to swap out partners didn't make sense.

And wasn't Adama a surprise? The Old Man was downright flirting with the Prez. Maybe he's enjoying all the head-butting more than he's been letting on.

And last, though far from least... we finally got a little equity for the ladies in the eye candy department. #6 kept her clothes on while Lee took his off. IT'S ABOUT TIME!!!

[CrimsonCrystal]

Really enjoyed this episode.

I was particularly thrilled at how Zarek was used to "voice" certain questions the viewer/audience might have.

What economy? What government? The money as value? Do we go about our normal lives? What's normal? Don't they have to re-think their society?

So you have two groups. The one in power that isn't moving fast enough. The group out of power but wants to do all sorts of crazy things.

Pretty interesting that Apollo and Starbuck rack together in the same berth. Makes perfect sense considering she is the closest thing he has to a best friend and they run the airgroup.

So has anyone noticed that when Apollo looks at Starbuck he's always sneaking a peak at her looks? But Starbuck likes to look him directly in the eyes. Not that Apollo doesn't look her in the eyes, but this seems noticable.

Nice to see that RDM is following an unfortunate but true aspect of human history: population crashes and resource crashes leads to all sorts of craziness (dictators, extremists, etc.).

[Thedepressedcyclon]

Starbuck's limp in this episode seemed odd to me. In the Hand Of God, she was working out and ready to jump into a viper and I really don't remember her limping about.

In Colonial Day, especially during the bar fight, she has her cane and is limping very badly.

Almost seemed as if this episode was meant to be aired earlier, say before the Hand of God?

[Silentwolfdog]

Maybe becuz Starbuck's knee wasnt supposed to fall on the ground which can cause it to hurt badly. Seem like to me she can run and walk okay as long as she dont overdo it, but in the fight she overdo her knee (she fell few times) and hurt herself. Which is reason why Adama wont let her fly the viper, her knee cant handle too much pressure or twist.

I never notice Lee liking to sneak a peek. I need to check the ep again about that.

I also realized that it wasnt her foot that kick the bottle toward Apollo it was her cane that did it. I put it, the tape, on slow motion mode to see what happened and that's how I found out it was the cane. How cool. It was powerful weapon for that ep that day lol.

[caseOrange]

This is 5/5 for me, and i really can't believe all the criticisms being heaped upon it. My biggest criticism of most of the series has been that main story arcs have been reconciled too quickly. This one may have been, too, but it played out more naturally than other eps.

As a fan of the show, i still don't like Tom Zarek, but his character made some valid points. i also think that Richard Hatch's acting has improved vastly since he was Apollo; although IMHO some of this might be do to the fact that he is playing the catalyst for an overthrow of the re-imagined fleet, given that he was so staunchly opposed to TNS (until they gave him a role in it).

i thought the politics was fascinating and Roslin once again showed her growing adeptness for it. i liked the contrasting eloquence between Zarek's anti-Roslin speech and Baltar's pro-Roslin speech. Except for a few inconsistencies already mentioned in this thread, probably my biggest criticism (which really isn't a criticism, just something i couldn't help) is the party scene at the end. Although it was nice to see the crew having fun, Baltar getting away from Six, Adama and Roslin loosening up a bit (and Starbuck all gussied up!), i couldn't help but draw a comparison to the Ewok dance at the end of Return of the Jedi. Once that image got into my head, it was hard to get it out.

Nothing personal ernestborg9, but i have to take issue with a few of your criticisms.

ernestborg9 said:

* There has been no real sight nor sound of the Cloud Nine (admittedly a wonderfully-ironic name) in the fleet until now - and this is being passed off as being because she has been "under repair".

There are quite a few vessels in the fleet we haven't learned about. Mostly during the series we see Galactica or Colonial One close-up and the rest of the fleet in the background. We were introduced to Colonial One and the Astral Queen in the Mini, and the Olympic Carrier and the Rising Star in "33". i hope more will be introduced as the series continues into season 2.

ernestborg9 said:

* Zarek's challenge for the position of Veep is an obvious construction to lay the path for Gaius Baltar to become the Vice President.

i guess i'm just dense, but that didn't seem obvious to me. i thought Wallace Gray's nomination was more of an obvious put-up for Baltar, although only from a viewer's perspective: the characters don't see it coming until Roslin hears Baltar's speech on talk wireless.

ernestborg9 said:

* It is surprising that, after her somewhat vicious words to him in Six Degrees of Separation, Roslin can face off with Baltar without so much as an apology for past actions.

* It is equally surprising that Baltar's ego doesn't offer greater resistance. True, she is to a degree panderin to his desire to be back in the limelight - but given his nature, such an open "forgive and forget" doesn't entirely sit with his nature.

That's politics. Plus Baltar is basically a worm, whether he's a genius or not, and whether he's got a Victoria's Secret model in his head or not.

ernestborg9 said:

Security is supposedly tight on "Cloud Nine", yet a brawl in a bar outside of the ballroom where the Quroum is being held goes on uninterrupted by any security force

You can't prevent a fight with security present. Fights break out and security jumps in to stop it. This fight happened to be with an actual security officer while another security officer sat at a nearby table.

ernestborg9 said:

Lee Adama is deeply concerned about security, yet leaves Valance in what is clearly a make-do holding area when it would have been a simple task to ship him back to the far more secure Galactica and let others question him there.

i don't think Apollo was worried because Valance was manacled in a small room with two guards posted at the door. Shipping him to Galactica would have raised a few eyebrows since they are at an obviously very important meeting with only 500 delegates on the entire vessel and massive media coverage. i'm sure they didn't want to cause any panic throughout the fleet by letting on that a possible presidential assassin had made it onto Cloud 9. It also would cause the fleet to feel uneasy about Galactica's ability to protect them.

ernestborg9 said:

If Roslin is assassinated at the Quorum (whether or not Zarek gets to be Veep) - suspicion is bound to fall on Zarek - either disqualifying him as a candidate, or paralysing his ability to ascend to the presidency.

May be. But it also causes chaos in an unstable society, which Zarek seems to thrive on.

ernestborg9 said:

If he is genuinely after the position of president, then as the VP, he would have every opportunity to build a track record as an effective politician, and thus stand as a highly competent alternative to Roslin in the elections in 6 months - so killing her again is hardly necessary.

i think you're giving him a little too much credit. He's spent 20 years in prison--he wants power ASAP.

BTW, did anyone catch the play on "The Capitol Gang" (a real tv show in the US) with "The Colonial Gang"? Also, i thought the host of the show (i forgot his name) was reminiscent of Bill O'Reilly (another US political talk show host).
;D

[metroid]

Someone please throw Ellen Tigh out an airlock!!!!!!!!! I wonder if she's the one that offed the would be assassin. She's quite the security leak of high level information.

[Roadrunner]

Just my own impression, but I too think that Ellen was responsible for Vallance's death... not Tom Zarek. She has plans. Those plans include Zarek. Vallance was a threat to those plans. And she obviously has connections with somebody of influence who resides on the Rising Star, that she wants poor whipped Saul to chat with. Hmmm. The Rising Star. Wasn't that the ship that mysteriously and miraculously rescued her from Picon? NOT! Her presence there was never an accident.

I also don't think Vallance was a prospective assassin. I think he was supposed to hand off the goods to someone else. He was just too twitchy and meek in the interrogation. Presidential assassins have a history of wanting people to know what they've done, and why they did it. I think he was a delivery boy -- bringing the weapon, the schedule, ooh and payment too! The question as to whether Zarek was the instigator of the plot... I don't know. Vallance was obviously one of Zarek's supporters, and Zarek knew who he was... but the President does have other vocal detractors among the Council of Twelve -- some who also support Zarek.

The plot thickens.

[prism700]

Roadrunner said:

Just my own impression, but I too think that Ellen was responsible for Vallance's death... not Tom Zarek. She has plans. Those plans include Zarek. Vallance was a threat to those plans. And she obviously has connections with somebody of influence who resides on the Rising Star, that she wants poor whipped Saul to chat with. Hmmm. The Rising Star. Wasn't that the ship that mysteriously and miraculously rescued her from Picon? NOT! Her presence there was never an accident.
.

I agree look out for Ellen Tigh next season. Her conversation with Tigh at the end was interesting...she is definately part of some scheme and i think she needs Tigh and his position in the military to assert influence or authority. The only thing i think she might be overestimating is Tigh's overall influence - he's a good officer but he is still unpopular with the crew. Will they follow him? Also will Ellen underestimate her husband's loyalty to his friend and Commander? Lets face it he owes Adama a hell of a lot and i think he has acknowledged that on several occassions (remember his chat with the President over whether Adama was a cylon?).

I can't wait to see how this pans out

[MHall]

Wallace Grey does not belong here. Cloud 9 does not belong here. Tasha Yar does not belong here. Spock is not supposed to have beard. Something is wrong. We are now either in the Battlestar Galactica 1980 "bad writing" universe, or, much more likely, the "Mirror, Mirror" BSG universe. My theory is that there is no bad writing in Battlestar Galactica TNS. Anything that seems to suck is there for a reason, IMO.

I suspect Adama is our Adama. I suspect everybody else is from a parallel universe to which our Adama has changed places with another Adama (an "evil" one!) The change must have happened near the start of episode 9, when Adama was off ship or soon after he returned. After that, Roslin suspected Adama had been replaced by a duplicate, Tigh suspected Adama of being a Cylon or at least of receiving Cylon comminiques (deleted scene only, ep 9), Gaeta started acting twitchy in the background, Gaeta started playing poker (right?), Gaeta became a party animal (ep 11), Roslin found religion, and Lee Adama found some balls (ep 10). Could future episodes have more out of character events? A "Mirror Mirror" universe that stretches for several episodes?! Fascinating!

So who would Sulu be? Gaeta? (But mythologically, this poses problems, as Gaeta maps to Athena, who is basically a pacifist unless defending herself or civilization, in which case she is a b i t c h from hell.) Spock is second in command, so does that make Tigh Spock? Will Tigh help the "Mirror, Mirror" Adama get back to where he belongs? Anyone think there is any merit to this theory?

Mythologically, this is the only episode I have not really mapped to Greek myths. Any help out there? I remember I concluded that Wallace Grey was the most likely target of the assassin, mythologically, but now I don't even remember why. If Wallace Grey doesn't belong here, was the assassin just trying to correct the time-line?

[1987SilverOak]

I can't wait till Friday for the S1 2 part finale. Man this is the best show on TV. Its great to know we will be getting at least a 2nd season.

[erika]

[quote author=mattw65

Did anyone notice the bottle of Jack Daniels over Zarak’s right shoulder while he was serving Ellen Tigh? The continuity editor should be shot or something.

[/quote]

In Ron Moore's podcast he actually says soemthing like he doesn't mind if things like that are there, as it's along the lines of parrallel development. he actually considered using 'Fly me me to the moon' the songoin an ep.

[caseOrange]

erika said:

In Ron Moore's podcast he actually says soemthing like he doesn't mind if things like that are there, as it's along the lines of parrallel development.

So, in other words, he doesn't mind driving BSG freaks like us (who debate little things like this) fracking nuts!

[CylonGod]

caseOrange said:

As a fan of the show, i still don't like Tom Zarek, but his character made some valid points. i also think that Richard Hatch's acting has improved vastly since he was Apollo; although IMHO some of this might be do to the fact that he is playing the catalyst for an overthrow of the re-imagined fleet, given that he was so staunchly opposed to TNS (until they gave him a role in it).

I never thought about that caseOrange but it makes perfect sence to me. Good catch!