Witch hunts?

[Brazedowl]

Up until Episode #6 I have been very pleased with the separation of BSG from mainstream language and history. In Episode #6, Adama frequently refers to the tribunal as a "witch hunt". Now this is a phrase that is directly associated with the random accusations of individuals in Salem Mass. as being witches, and later to the communist "witch hunts" in the 1950's.

I don't even know if there is a parallel in British history much less in the history of another solar system.

Just a little peeve.

[mjm800]

Maybe they should have called it a Fshiyedws Hunt because the audience would understand exactly what they meant.

[Blade Runner]

mjm800 said:

Maybe they should have called it a Fshiyedws Hunt because the audience would understand exactly what they meant.

[Brazedowl]

Whatever. Better have left it out all together.

[CylonGod]

Brazedowl said:

Up until Episode #6 I have been very pleased with the separation of BSG from mainstream language and history. In Episode #6, Adama frequently refers to the tribunal as a "witch hunt". Now this is a phrase that is directly associated with the random accusations of individuals in Salem Mass. as being witches, and later to the communist "witch hunts" in the 1950's.

I don't even know if there is a parallel in British history much less in the history of another solar system.

Just a little peeve.

Actually witch hunts started in Europe long before the Salem ones. Here is a link about some early witch hunts in the UK and near by islands.
www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-carlson/witchtrial/eis.html
This one is for European witch hunts
www.gendercide.org/case_witchhunts.html

The Salem ones are just famous. In Europe witchs where burned at the stake especially in France. I can't imagine that the space faring 12 colonies ever had witch hunts but it is possable.

[Brazedowl]

That is true. Leave it to the Catholics of the dark ages to persicute the defenceless.

Maybe they could have just took like a 20sec backstory comment about a witch hunt in their past. I don't know it just seemed like they were pulling from Earth's history not their own.

[Ziptie]

mjm800 said:

Maybe they should have called it a Fshiyedws Hunt.

Steady on, you do know that Fshiyedws is a disgustingly heinous swearword in Welsh? ;D

Brazedowl, you're right to say that the use of the term "witch hunt" draws a direct parallel with Earth history, but it's difficult to see what alternative term could have been used to get the same message across to an earthbound audience economically.

RDM has said elsewhere that there are a number of quite deliberate echoes of Earth history in the BSG universe, one can only presume that this is another. As has already been said, there were (literal) "witch hunts" in Britain and mainland Europe prior to the colonisation of America. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to assume that something similar happened in Colonial history.

[Corwin]

Brazedowl said:

Maybe they could have just took like a 20sec backstory comment about a witch hunt in their past. I don't know it just seemed like they were pulling from Earth's history not their own.

So you're quite happy for them to worship the Greek Gods but not to use the term Witch Hunt?

[Brazedowl]

Touche salesman! I too have an uncle.

I concede the point.

[Bud Groover]

Ah, but do they worship the greek gods because they may have been the forebears of the aztecs, the egyptians, the mayans?

I get just a little annoyed by the parellels to US military life - I mean, what the chances that both the US military AND that of the 12 colonies would call that landing light thing a meatball? How does it resemble a meatball? How could they both think it does?

(I just bet someone here has the answer re: US Navy too).

But then I remind myself that the chances that these two entities would even speak the same language is beyond remote, and all of these parellels are done simply to communicate the story to me. And thus I am sated.

Some believe that there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive a Fshiyedws Hunt somewhere out there, beyond the stars....

[Big Brother]

Bud said:

I get just a little annoyed by the parellels to US military life - I mean, what the chances that both the US military AND that of the 12 colonies would call that landing light thing a meatball? How does it resemble a meatball? How could they both think it does?

Ah, but as G'Kar pointed out in an episode of Babylon 5, every sentient species in the galaxy has a food that is indistinguishable from Swedish Meatballs. The Narn call theirs "breen". Which is both the name of a race on Star Trek (who in turn resemble a race from Star Wars almost precisely) and the name of a French teacher at my sister's high school. Coincidence?

Bud said:

(I just bet someone here has the answer re: US Navy too).

It's actually a British invention. The Brits invented much of modern carrier technology, including the steam catapault and the angled flight deck, but they came up with them in the middle of WW2, when the Brits were mainly facing a U-boat threat and thus couldn't assign a high enough priority to new carrier construction to build many of them with the new technology.

[Daliden]

As long as you're OK with them speaking English in the first place, the usage of idioms like "witch hunt" should not bother you too much

[Bud Groover]

That's perfectly right... I am sated. Satisfied. Content. Fed beyond capacity or desire, even.

[Cosmic Superchunk]

The parallels between the 12 Colonies and our modern "Earth" was done on purpose, so the fact that they use language or terms that are familiar to us based on our own history should come as no surprise. They are related to us and their society is such that we can relate to it. They wear suits, ties, carry phones and use other "familiar" objects just like us. The Colonial military hierarchy is set with ranks that are familiar to us. The officers' uniforms, flightsuits and enlisted personnel's BDUs are similar to what our military uniforms are like. Hey, they use our alphabet and they even speak English with Canadian and American accents (except for Baltar and his eloquent European English accent). What's the big deal?

What makes the series appealing to me is that Colonial society is so Earth-like that you can put yourself in their place. You can relate to everyting that's going on and it makes the drama more realistic. I also find it fascinating that their religion appears to be for the most part polytheistic. There are the references made to the gods Apollo and Zeus who are a part of our history and myths. They pray to the Lords of Kobol, although I think it's safe to assume that like Earth, the Colonials may have many spiritual paths including some monotheistic faiths.

[caseOrange]

Corwin said:

So you're quite happy for them to worship the Greek Gods but not to use the term Witch Hunt?

These gods may be Universal. Who are we to claim them for our own, as ours may have been only one of many thousands of planets they visited or performed feats on. We have our own history of what they did here on Earth, but other planets may know them for other things. They went by the same names and had the same characteristics. The lessons they taught may have been carried out differently, but the morals and principles were always the same.

Or maybe they were there in the early years of Kobol, and humans took these stories with them everywhere they settled.

Cosmic said:

The parallels between the 12 Colonies and our modern "Earth" was done on purpose, so the fact that they use language or terms that are familiar to us based on our own history should come as no surprise. They are related to us and their society is such that we can relate to it. They wear suits, ties, carry phones and use other "familiar" objects just like us. The Colonial military hierarchy is set with ranks that are familiar to us. The officers' uniforms, flightsuits and enlisted personnel's BDUs are similar to what our military uniforms are like. Hey, they use our alphabet and they even speak English with Canadian and American accents (except for Baltar and his eloquent European English accent). What's the big deal?

That still doesn't mean that their history is the same. Witch hunts happened on Earth, which was founded after the group of humans broke away from Kobol. The characters in BSG don't even think that there is an Earth, much less that anything happened on it.

All these instances are things that could come naturally through evolution to the human race no matter where in the Universe they might be located--especially if they all started in one place, as is the case with BSG. In other words, if given a planet with the same atmosphere and geology as earth, and anywhere from a few thousand years to a million years, any human race will develop cell phones. i don't think the term "witch hunt" is race-specific, although the tendency towards one may be.

Brazedowl said:

Maybe they could have just took like a 20sec backstory comment about a witch hunt in their past.

i agree. Hate to nitpick, but using the term "witch hunt" without a believable story behind it that's in context with BSG is just a glaring hole.

Ziptie said:

...but it's difficult to see what alternative term could have been used to get the same message across to an earthbound audience economically.

Maybe they could have used "inquisition" in some way. It's a word that can be used with or without referencing the Spanish Inquisition (i.e., "This pointless inquistion is absurd, Sgt. Hadrian!").

There's my two cents. It might actually be a nickel's worth. ;D